Starting to understand the Team's priorities

I think I’m finally starting to understand the priorities the Team places on updates an fixes and updates.

If you look at the last two patches we’ve had out, you would see one on the 3rd of November which seems to be fixing issues with premium music: https://forums.plex.tv/discussion/comment/1293089/#Comment_1293089 Then the next update is on the 4th of November: https://forums.plex.tv/discussion/comment/1294018/#Comment_1294018 again, fixing music issues.

Yet we had to wait almost a week to get the fix for collections, tags and sharing to get pushed out when the Web App broke this functionality. (25th of October’s update breaking tag editing, 31st October fixing it.)

Anyone else forming any opinions on how the Team sets the priorities?

PMs came out for the shieldtv with great fanfare - and great bugs. Missing files in libraries, can’t use external storage, etc etc. Since then a bunch of things came out and were fix, but that platform is still useless for most. I guess all deva are working on Plex Cloud…

As always, still wondering what Plex is thinking. I love the product, but support for it and communicating with the community has always been a problem.

I just going to go with the assumption that they have a build path with release dates that they want to push updates and features out. These occur in between major releases. Now with that said, they can push out updates that are related to bug fixes/issues that are not scheduled. While we might assume that they are catering to one over another it just may be that these updates were developed, tested, and scheduled to be release before they could isolate and recode the issue from Oct 25 as you stated.

Just my 2 cents …

You are giving them too much credit i think …

One, I don’t think there is a development plan…

Two . They for sure have no quality assurance section let alone a full qualification test regimine…

Basically when I envision the plex dev team… I think of the little dutch boy trying to patch the hoover dam during an earthquake…

At the rate they are breaking functionality the product will be completely useless by the first of the year…

Whenever we inquire about this, they claim that they can do more than 1 thing at a time. But their actions suggest otherwise.

Wonky new fringe features that get introduced with lots of bugs = top priority
High-value, top-voted core features and bugs tons of people have been crying for for years = lowest priority

@MikeG6.5 , I am disappointed by your lack of “time to face the music” puns. This thread title was the perfect place for it. hahahaha

That said, I do think it is odd how features seem to come in waves. “music stuff” and then later there will be “search stuff” and then maybe “interface stuff”. It almost always feels like there’s a “theme” to every release.

I had an opportunity to speak with a number of developers a while back, including @elan. During this time I had their ears, I made it obvious that Plex is potentially the best app suite I have ever used. My enthusiasm for the whole package was at an all time low, but even then I was positive in what the Team could do to raise it. I was one of 2 users that were invited to this discussion. @Elijah_Baley was the other.

The two of us told the Team our goals, each with our own ideas of what we envisioned Plex to be. And where Plex falls sadly short. In the time since that meeting I see Plex’s direction to be even further from the goals of the users than it was prior to that meeting. I went to that meeting with a list of things prepared from folks like @cayars, @Plexhilarated , and a few others. I came prepared, but it seems I was the only one. They’ve given us some bones to gnaw on, but nothing with any meat to it. (Server side speed limits on a per user basis? What we got was global limits for all users, that might also enforce those limits on local connections, too! Definitely NOT what we asked for!)

@freggit said:
I just going to go with the assumption that they have a build path with release dates that they want to push updates and features out. These occur in between major releases. Now with that said, they can push out updates that are related to bug fixes/issues that are not scheduled. While we might assume that they are catering to one over another it just may be that these updates were developed, tested, and scheduled to be release before they could isolate and recode the issue from Oct 25 as you stated.

Just my 2 cents …

Interesting that you choose to defend their breaking of the tags. According to the various posts others had regarding this, it was identified as a bug introduced in the Web App.

To give some history, once upon a time, if there was a bug in the Web App, System or other subset of the PMS install, all that was needed was to stop PMS, Delete the appropriate bundle and then restart PMS. The missing bundle was identified and a new updated one would be downloaded from Plex’s main repository. This functionality is no longer an option, as the tests for missing bundles either no longer work, or has been removed.

Within 24 hours of the announcement of this collection/tags bug being identified, a new version of the Web App was released for use via the “Launch” button on Plex.tv. Then within another 24 hours or so another update to the Web App was also released. Taking the Web App from the buggy V2.10.5 to V2.10.7. The current version available via the “Launch” button is V2.10.10.

The problem is, this updated Web App can’t be installed locally. If you want or need the improved functionality you HAVE to go in through the plex.tv site to interact with this new Web App. For those who don’t want to access their collections through an external site, they have to endure the bug until a new release of PMS is made available. And if you need the functions of V2.10.10 you are “SoL” until a new version of PMS comes along to update the Web App locally.

This is BROKEN! When the Team introduces a bug to the environment and we are forced to endure the bug because it can’t be installed locally, this is not “working as intended”. For those who either don’t want to or can’t use plex.tv for interacting with their server, they have no choice but to endure a broken application until a new update is released via the entire PMS package.

We have too many cases like this lately, where a fix for a given feature is identified and released, but isn’t available until a new version of PMS is pushed out.

1000’s of votes for features on the Feature Request forum indicate the majority of users want certain level of functionality. Yet the driving force is no longer what the users are requesting. It has become obvious to most of us that have been here a while that the bread is buttered by the investors, and we have to eat what they dish out. And let’s not forget to say our “Pleases” and “Thank Yous” while we’re at it.

To say I’m disappointed with the way the whole suite is going is a huge understatement at this point. Had the open source competition been available to me when I first installed Plex I would have tried it then, and likely been much happier with the whole experience than I am now. The same things we have asked for here have been available with that app suite for a long time. That suite’s only shortcomings are lack of client apps. (Which could also be seen as a + to some people.)

I’m no longer positive about anything other than this one glaring thought… Money talks. And investors represent a lot of potential money influx. What we want as users are secondary concerns to what the investors want, regardless of our Pass status or not. This is reinforced time and again, by just reading the patch notices… (Try it once, browse through them and see if you don’t see what others are seeing…)

@jkalland said:
@MikeG6.5 , I am disappointed by your lack of “time to face the music” puns. This thread title was the perfect place for it. hahahaha

Thing of it is, I have NO USE for music at all in Plex, so the thought had never crossed my mind. Too bad, really… It’s a great idea!

@MikeG6.5 said:
The two of us told the Team our goals, each with our own ideas of what we envisioned Plex to be. And where Plex falls sadly short. In the time since that meeting I see Plex’s direction to be even further from the goals of the users than it was prior to that meeting. I went to that meeting with a list of things prepared from folks like @cayars, @Plexhilarated , and a few others. I came prepared, but it seems I was the only one. They’ve given us some bones to gnaw on, but nothing with any meat to it. (Server side speed limits on a per user basis? What we got was global limits for all users, **that might also enforce those limits on local connections, too! ** Definitely NOT what we asked for!)

What? I set up upload speed limits and my local clients don’t apply… Did I miss something?

If you set up WAN limits, those should only affect WAN streaming sessions. But what a lot of people have found is setting a WAN limit somehow enforces a LAN limit as well.

Supposedly the “fix” is the Authorized Network tags set to your scope. This has helped some, but not all…

@MikeG6.5 said:
If you set up WAN limits, those should only affect WAN streaming sessions. But what a lot of people have found is setting a WAN limit somehow enforces a LAN limit as well.

Supposedly the “fix” is the Authorized Network tags set to your scope. This has helped some, but not all…

You mean through the registry key edit, or the web UI? I’ve used the web UI settings without issues… But I’m on osx.

Through the Web UI. When they made the patch to put this in, it’s been causing problems for some people… It’s not affecting everyone…

PMS 1.2.7 had just been released which updates Plex Web to 2.10.10.

Edit - released to all, not just Plex Pass

Wow… I am honored that my concerns and ideas and experience with Plex are worthy of company with folks like @cayars and @MikeG6.5, but honestly, my disappointment in Plex has me thinking of changing my name to Plexasperated.

For various reasons, you all haven’t seen or heard much of me for several months. In fact I couldn’t even tell you right now what version of PMS I’m even running. It’s not that I’ve found anything better… it’s just that after a while you get tired of feeling like you’re just yelling down an empty well. In hindsight… I think I lost it with this response.

Decades ago, I worked for a Silicon Valley start-up that took some Venture Capital. I know what happens, and have seen it again.

So we only had what, 24 hours of a new Web App before we could use it locally? Not bad, I suppose, considering the 6 days we had to wait for the fix for collections and tags…

I know you’re trying @MovieFan.Plex to paint a bright picture. The problem is, for a lot of us that have been trying to make things better for so long, we all have darker shades on our pallet. We’re so used to being disappointed with what we’ve gotten it’s hard to see the shaft of sunlight.

@Plexhilarated I feel the frustrations. Every day when I scroll through my movies looking for something and have to deal with the 300-400 extra icons in it because we don’t have a working Collections system. Or when I try to drill down to a specific movie without knowing it’s name, and can’t use blacklist filtering. Or try to set up permissions for a new user and can’t use Blacklist Sharing options. Or watch one user streaming something from me, and getting told that my LOCAL movie doesn’t have enough bandwidth to support it.

Or have to open a separate browser window up to see who is watching what, or who has watched what, because the historical information isn’t tracked within Plex itself. We should be able to click on a movie or TV show and SEE who has watched, when, how often, what bitrate, were they buffering or was it smooth. Was it transcoded or Direct Played or what? Instead we have to go to another app, cross-referencing it’s DB with Plex’s DB to find out what’s happening. This is DARK AGES STUFF! This should all be in ONE PLACE and not scattered across 2 apps.

Instead we get an underpowered router version of the PMS app, with a list of limitations that only small NASes have to contend with. Or the NVidia Shield now having PMS available on it. And a whole new set of limitations and problems associated with this device.

I guess my biggest frustration is that a product I care for as strongly as Plex is going in directions that are so contrary to where it should be going for the health of the whole ecosystem. I’ve set up several systems for friends, and done more than a few with Team Viewer through the Asustor forums. And right now I’ve put a hold on it, because I no longer believe Plex is going in a direction I feel comfortable with. I won’t steer people to a platform if I no longer believe in it.

That’s where I’m at…

The main focus I think is on features to expand the market for Plex products. Those who will maintain a server area a small and maybe even shrinking group. The share of homes with computers other than mobile devices is I think shrinking.

@brucethevideobug said:
The main focus I think is on features to expand the market for Plex products. Those who will maintain a server area a small and maybe even shrinking group. The share of homes with computers other than mobile devices is I think shrinking.

Hence why they’re doing Plex Cloud. Not saying it’s a perfect idea (no encryption is a big issue for most), but it will fix the issues people are having with transcoding power, storage, bandwidth… so more “casual” server owners will be happy with that.

I am thinking about rolling out my 0.9.12 pre pass… pre security, pre bullshit so I can have a backend the feeds the big screen HTPC system again without issues…

that way I can use it without tokens, without signing in and it just flat out worked better… combined with openPHT and its golden…

the zitfaced kids can keep this new mobile media machine… its worthless for home users that want a solid big screen experiance and its only getting worse.

collections what a joke… more than half my movies are in a ‘collection’ that is only one movie… itself… great logic there…

I think it high time that we get together and fork the code and go back to basics…

I think you hit on a very valid point that’s easy to overlook, and is actually how the world seems to beb mvoing now (not just Plex), @dragonmel :

Plex is very much starting to feel like it’s built for mobile and made to support bigger screens, as opposed to the other way around. “Mobile First” is the buzzword du-jour (and anyone who says it’s not mobile first but is instead responsive is kidding themselves 9 times out of 10)

Hey, @MikeG6.5 , how do you like today’s annoucement? Was it in your priorities?