I did a search on this forum and it looks like no one has previously requested that support be added for Hi-res audio formats, such as SACD .iso and DSD DFF/DSF.
Would anyone else be interested in Plex adding support for Hi-res music?
If you're a music lover and are new to Hi-res audio you owe it to yourself to get your hands on a few Hi-res tracks from some of your favorite artists and, with the proper audio equipment (quality headphones, good DAC, etc), have a listen.
For more info on Hi-res music here is a good place to start:
More and more devices are coming into the market which support Hi-res music natively, like Sony's Xperia Z3 smartphones and some of their Walkman products. We're also seeing more sources for Hi-res music come onto the market, including Spotify-like rental options.
Hi-res music appears to be trending and would be great to see Plex get out in front!
AFAIK DSD is not supported and I guess there are not that many Plex users that have ripped their own SACD's yet. ;)
If you are looking at HD-Audio you might want to consider PHT as a client. It handles my HD-musicfiles which are mostly flac without any problems up to 24/192. This is the max for my external DAC but accordingly to the specs, the audio engine should be capable of up to 24/384.
AFAIK DSD is not supported and I guess there are not that many Plex users that have ripped their own SACD's yet. ;)
That's somewhat understandable given that arguably Plex is more known for video than music.
Also, I suspect more people are interested in Plex for it streaming rather than offline capabilities, and I can't imagine trying to stream DSD file to my smartphone on 3G (or even my somewhat spotty 4G). But Plex Pass offers offline storage, so that would work well with DSD files.
If you are looking at HD-Audio you might want to consider PHT as a client. It handles my HD-musicfiles which are mostly flac without any problems up to 24/192. This is the max for my external DAC but accordingly to the specs, the audio engine should be capable of up to 24/384.
I love PHT. It's a big step up from the Plex browser app in terms of music quality.
However, Plex doesn't recognize my growing collection of .iso and .dff files so I can't play those in PHT. Instead I'm looking at having to purchase something like Audiravana.
Would be great if Hi-res support was added to the PHT roadmap!
However, Plex doesn't recognize my growing collection of .iso and .dff files so I can't play those in PHT. Instead I'm looking at having to purchase something like Audiravana.
Image based formats (aka .iso's) have never been supported by Plex, and the work around that allowed them to work was recently intentionally removed - I really would not be holding your breath to ever see it come back. Support for .DSF files was recently added to FFMPEG, so at least it will at some point be an option to work in the Plex world (with the caveat of decoding only, there is no downsampling support). If you want support for .DFF files, then the FFMPEG guys are the people you need to convince as support will need to exist there before it can exist in Plex. (though .DFF is not considered an "attractive format" given it has no metadata support.)
Image based formats (aka .iso's) have never been supported by Plex, and the work around that allowed them to work was recently intentionally removed.
I would be curious to know how well this did work, and the back story on why such a feature was 'intentionally' disabled?
Support for .DSF files was recently added to FFMPEG, so at least it will at some point be an option to work in the Plex world (with the caveat of decoding only, there is no downsampling support). If you want support for .DFF files, then the FFMPEG guys are the people you need to convince as support will need to exist there before it can exist in Plex. (though .DFF is not considered an "attractive format" given it has no metadata support.)
That's good to hear about .DFF, and decoding only would be fine AFAIAC.
Again, given how passionate the Plex user community is about high-quality content I am surprised there aren't more people pushing for more Hi-res support.
If you are an audiophile and are looking for a Plex-like solution for .iso, .dsf, .dff, is there anywhere else for you to go? If not, how can I help effectively lobby the FFMPEG folks to add support?
Thank for the link to the Sonore spreadsheet, that is a great resource. I emailed one of the guys who maintains it about stuff that's missing (eg Xperia Z3) and they wrote back saying there were too many new things coming online and could no longer maintain it. So that's another great endorsement for the growth of Hi-res music!
Sonore also said finding something like Plex for Hi-res music could be tough to find. There is something in their spreadsheet called minimserver.com is listed as DSD compatible. I didn't find anything on minimserver.com's website about DSD though, and no mention of Android/iOS apps. Anyone heard of it or tried it?
At the bare minimum it would seem Plex could start by offering people the option offline download sync full files rather than limiting downloads to 320kbps. Why take the full copy choice away from users?
Well, no announcement yesterday of support added for Hi-Res music files like .dff etc :(
Hi-Res would be one of the ways Plex could distinguish itself from CD quality streaming sites like Tidal etc, which have a ton of music, all the music and album art tagged correctly, and for reasons I don't understand sound much better than Plex when playing identical tracks (even when using the Plex Home Theatre app).
Music is becoming a much more competitive space. While the announcement yesterday is good step, it's also just a catch-up step. Adding 24-bit Hi-Res music compatibility would be a big jump over what the competition is doing.
Music is becoming a much more competitive space. While the announcement yesterday is good step, it's also just a catch-up step. Adding 24-bit Hi-Res music compatibility would be a big jump over what the competition is doing.
Saying that you want to support Hi-Res ISO files does not mean anything as ISO files are a common disk image distribution format. What you want support for it what is inside that .iso file, right? The distinction is important.
FLAC files are supported today in at least PHT, so lossless music is already in place. There is always room for more formats (create a feature request for it in the feature request subforum if you are a Plexpass subscriber), but if you want hi-res (hi-def), then you can start using it already.
Saying that you want to support Hi-Res ISO files does not mean anything as ISO files are a common disk image distribution format. What you want support for it what is inside that .iso file, right? The distinction is important.
FLAC files are supported today in at least PHT, so lossless music is already in place. There is always room for more formats (create a feature request for it in the feature request subforum if you are a Plexpass subscriber), but if you want hi-res (hi-def), then you can start using it already.
Sorry if I'm not being clear, my understanding of file containers is a bit limited.
Basically, I would love to see Plex add the same capability as programs like Foobar, which can play my .iso file SACD rips.
If adding .iso support is asking too much then it would be wonderful if Plex added support for Hi-Res file formats like .dff and .dsf. These file formats are starting to see more and more support on software and devices from Sony, Onkyo, etc.
Bad news from Elan in the new music announcement blog post comments (pasted below).
I'm really surprised that the Plex developers haven't heard of these Hi-Res music file formats. This is a big opportunity for Plex to differentiate itself and stay ahead of the competition.
What about support for Hi-res music files like .dff?
elanApril 30, 2015 at 3:48 pm
@Transatlantic ~ Funny, I’ve never even _heard_ of those. So I’m guessing not yet
Bad news from Elan in the new music announcement blog post comments (pasted below).
I'm really surprised that the Plex developers haven't heard of these Hi-Res music file formats. This is a big opportunity for Plex to differentiate itself and stay ahead of the competition.
What about support for Hi-res music files like .dff?
elanApril 30, 2015 at 3:48 pm
@Transatlantic ~ Funny, I’ve never even _heard_ of those. So I’m guessing not yet
Well, same here. Never seen anyone mention those formats ever. FLAC and ALAC are supported, what do these new formats bring to the table that I have missed? :)
Well, same here. Never seen anyone mention those formats ever. FLAC and ALAC are supported, what do these new formats bring to the table that I have missed? :)
Lots of info on the Web about sound quality benefits of Hi-Res audio formats like DSD/SACD, etc, but here is a good article highlighting some of the existing software options for playing these types of files:
IMHO, supporting DSD file formats is a little bit ... weird.
To reap the sonic benefits of this storage format, one must use a fitting DSD digital to analog converter.
(Due to its special and radically different concept when compared to the usual DA converters which are used in all other devices.)
If you just convert this to 48kHz 24 bit PCM at playback time (and then play it back with a traditional DA-converter), like the foobar plugin does it - it is quite pointless. You'll be better off converting to a Flac and use this further on.
IMHO, supporting DSD file formats is a little bit ... weird.
To reap the sonic benefits of this storage format, one must use a fitting DSD digital to analog converter.
(Due to its special and radically different concept when compared to the usual DA converters which are used in all other devices.)
I agree with you that Hi-Res file formats are not useful for people who are happy listening to their music on their ear pods and idevice.
however, many people are purchasing separate Hi-Res DACs, and some devices such as the Sony line are incorporating DSD compatible DACs in the device itself.
is there a reason why repurposing the foobar Hi-Res plugins to Plex would be difficult? this would really give Plex a leg up with a passionate community of people who care a lot about audio quality. Major, major bragging rights.
like I said somewhere else, the new music features that Plex announced are very welcomed but they are mostly catch up features and do nothing to leapfrog other services.
I agree with you that Hi-Res file formats are not useful for people who are happy listening to their music on their ear pods and idevice.
however, many people are purchasing separate Hi-Res DACs, and some devices such as the Sony line are incorporating DSD compatible DACs in the device itself.
Even so, by using something like this foobar plugin, you cannot use the DSD-part of the DAC. Because the data is converted into the traditional PCM format before it reaches the DA converter.
To support DSD, the internal architecture of plex (or any player - even foobar!) must be radically overhauled. A move, that'll never happen I think.
The closest you can get to a HiRes audio experience right now is by using Plex Home Theater as client and a high quality AD converter which you set to a fixed 192kHz samplerate.
But even then almost all material will be mangled through the samplerate conversion. Switching the audio interface to the right SR automatically (as is possible in foobar with ASIO drivers) is not possible.
When I'm out and about I'll sometimes use Plex Home Theater with a Meridian USB DAC and a good set of headphones to play my FLAC files, and this produces good quality sound. But what would be even better is to be able to do what I can do with foobar and play my .dff and other Hi-Res files from inside Plex.
Here is some more information on the history of SACD ripping:
Note that as of early 2014 there are "now over 100 DSD-capable DACs, almost a dozen DSD download sites". With Sony, Onkyo, etc. making a big Hi-Res push this format will grow in popularity.
While I don't consider myself an audiophile or nearly as hard core as the guy operating under the pseudonym "HiResOrNothing", I will say that once you have a listen to Hi-Res using proper equipment and software you'll understand how I feel :)
