So to be clear, if my goal is I am getting too many people I share my library with and my upload speed just can’t handle it, is this the solution?
It is one of a few things you could do.
You could use Cloud Sync, use Plex Cloud or you could get your own collocated box at a datacenter and install the regular Plex Media Server on it and managed it like a regular server.
This sounds awesome, any word on will amazon have limits on how much bandwidth can be used. I think I have read that Dropbox and others only allows x amount of data used each day or month.
@dynon said:
Hey Guys - This looks very cool but It just occurred to me that this could potentially expose users to some potential legal hot water:
Could placing media on third party servers and streaming over a public network be seen as ‘broadcasting’? I’m unsure if this falls under fair use.
Your Amazon Cloud Drive is not a public network. No one’s Amazon Cloud Drive is a public network. The data traverses the public Internet in an encrypted state. Plex Cloud is no more public-facing than a properly-configured Plex Media Server running on your own metal. Share with a modest number of trusted friends and you’re okay.
What user data will be collected / logged by Amazon / Plex? How long will this data be retained?
Amazon and Plex have published privacy policies here and here, respectively. These are required by law and must be updated, however they’re not required to detail those updates until they affect you. That is, until you’ve been invited to the beta or the service opens to the public. In either instance you will have a chance to read it, consider any implications, and decide as only you can if it is or is not for you.
Will logs / user data be shared with third parties, government agencies, or any other party if requested.
Same as above, right?
How will Amazon / Plex respond to DMCA requests? How will users verify media ownership if requested.
It’s unlikely that Plex will be able to respond to DMCA requests at all. If they store no content, they have no content to remove. The lawyers filing them do so enough to know the difference. For this reason, it’s unlikely that they’ll even receive such requests to begin with.
Is there an updated privacy policy for Plex cloud?
There might be. I suppose we’ll find out soon enough.
Thoughts?
These are all good concerns. There’s so much speculation re: Plex Cloud happening right now and it’s nice to see that we’re thinking about data security and privacy. But it’s getting to be a bit echoy. I’ve spent years using Plex and I know that being patient while anticipating new stuff is quite difficult, but time after time the answers do come when the answers are ready. They’re just as excited to get this to us as we’re excited to get it, so they won’t leave us hanging for too long.
I suggest everyone to have the patience and read these posts (OPINIONS) by users NVader2000 and Elijah_Baley which I am going to quote and hope it will answer some questions that are on everyones minds and are afraid of posting about some issues with AWS.
1st Post (NVader2000):
This is surely going to get very interesting. Yes, I agree that you must own a legal copy of the media that you so choose to upload to AWS. However, even if everyone plays by the book, there is the P2P concept that will eventually spawn from this. Plex today allows you to share your content and most are not so willing to do so beyond their family or very close friends. However a Rogue Plex user is born. Said Rogue Plex user starts sharing their entire 100Tb library to the world. This is the part that I think AWS will have an issue with regardless if it is encrypted or not. AWS is now the largest PSP site in the world and they WILL shut that down.
On a personal note, however I do have a strong love for cloud, I would not want my personal “legally owned” content up on any cloud hosted storage, encrypted or not. Plus the bandwidth to stream all that content is not only going to be sub-par in comparison to local network bandwidth, but your ISP is going to get really pissed at your data usage and will start imposing data caps. 4K is here and 8K and 16K is just around the corner. You are going to need a lot more than 100Mb (sustained) FiOS circuit to be able to get the full quality (or N4KQ) 4K or anything 4K or greater.
I understand Plex’s reason to offer such an option, family photos and videos that have miniumal impact to starage and bandwidth but in reality most of the Plex users are using it to stream DVD/Blu-Ray videos to their TV and Home Theaters and with cheap NAS devices and the wide support by Plex for these devices I would think most user would prefer to keep their stuff in house. So I think for the short term and/or a very small community will adopt Plex Cloud.
Now lets add in “the hacker” this just took on a whole new direction and I foresee every Plex Cloud user pulling out. Sorry Plex, this is just no worth it no matter how you spin it.
Of course those articles, like almost everything else that attempts to discuss legalisms, are also a bit vague.
Remember that legal writing is a lot like the worst side of poetry: “The art of obscuring meaning with language.” And it all comes down to who has the most convincing lawyers not to what is “legal” or “right” or even “allowed.” So anything that can be “prove” with a “legal” document can also be disproved with the same.
My experiences with Amazon says to me that I can trust them not to exceed their basically stated position on this and I do not see that it would be in their best interest to actively go after users without other cause but each user needs to make up their own mind about the level of trust they are going to operate with in regard to each and every service they deal with.
BTW: I would never use Amazon or any other cloud storage as my only storage BUT, if I can actually figure a way with my limited upload speed to get my library backed up there I would be able to turn duplication off on my server’s Drivepool and thereby effectively double my storage space. In fact if this works and I can get my library up there I might even move my Drivepool to a lower power computer or even just turn it on to add files.
But, with my slow upload, it might take a year or two to get my library up there but, once that is done, my download is plenty fast to use the service. Even if the Plex cloud solution does not work out for me I think that it might ne a good idea for me to move my backups to the cloud. $60.00/year for unlimited storage is a good deal and, as I said, I pretty much trust Amazon to not become too big-brotherish.
3rd Post (NVader2000):
$60 for unlimited is a Bait-n-Switch tactic. I am voting that AWS starts blocking Plex users or better yet hand you over to the authorities legally obtained copies or not.
To Elijah_Baley point it is matter who has better lawyers, Amazon has very deep pockets and you as a Plex Cloud user are guanteed to lose and fast.
I sense the adoption rate falling rapidly already for Plex Cloud.
Another post (NVader2000):
Encrypted or not Amazon has the right to those files if they feel or if some tips them that they are illegal copies. Even if you were just up loading family photos, there is most likely going to be a lot of identifiable information in those pictures that a hacker can use. AWS is already a very large target, now add in millions of Plex Cloud users personal photos and you have desert for those hackers.
This was kind of the idea behind Plex in the first place. To host your on cloud of media stuff and letting you have full control of that content. Going cloud with Plex in my mind defeats that original concept.
The likely hood of Plex being sued by Amazon is very unlikely as Plex does not have the control over the AWS Cloud Drive account nor are they providing it as part of their services, only a method (proxy) to incorporate your AWS Cloud Drive with Plex. The Plex Cloud version of the PMS is not where the content is stored. So PMSC is separate from your AWS Cloud Drive. If I am incorrect, then Plex might have a law suit brewing down the road. Again, it is about how good your layers are.
Post about the encryption issue (NVader2000):
I do not think you understand, encrypted or not does not protect your from Amazon, only from being hacked from outside of AWS. People lose their Cloud accounts all the time for this very reason, sharing illegal content. It is so much so that it is not a Lime-Light worth event. So as to mitigate legal cost in run you through “The Mill” they simply warn you a few times and then if you fail to comply they just block your account.
I know this because I have a family member who worked at Amazon on their security and privacy team and now works for Microsoft. Accounts do get locked out for this very reason.
Put aside the legal ramification of it all, I do not think the solution is going to gain much ground even if everyone plays by the book. Streaming 4K and above content is going to hit your pipe really hard and your ISP is going to get really pissed and start capping your usage. Then as other join this Band Wagon they will simply impose a across the board cap on everyone regardless if your are part of it or not. So the people who do not have high data usage will suffer because of other people actions. I almost feel that Plex should pull this offering just for this purpose alone.
I do not think that Plex has much to benefit here, because most people will, after hopping on, will realize that they cannot stream much with out increasing their pipe and will just give all together put this offering into an expense from a maintenance and support perspective and realize that it is now costing them more money to support it than the amount new purchase will allow to support. I honestly think that Plex is reaching for additional revenue as most Plex users are either running the free edition or bit the bullet for the Live Time Plex Pass and now they are in need of a cash flow.
This is just my opinion.
Post about the issue of getting busted (NVader2000):
I disagree, people have gotten busted. Reddit is just another rumor mill. However I do agree that Amazon will not go after you just because, but when their hand is forced by Hollywood or the music industry. Granted most Plex Cloud users are not going to flip their content for a buck and this is far from SlyFox or Napster scenario, but a lot of people are just not going to throw their content up into the cloud. Pictures and some small family videos, maybe. Most will rather spend $200-$300 on a half way decent NAS with more storage than they will ever use, register the unit and install the app across their devices. It is just a secure if not more so and they can turn it off to the world far easier and faster than the cloud.
Again, I think this defeats the purpose of what Plex was built for in the first place. Also mark my words, ISP will start capping if not that then they will flip over to charging you per byte transferred across your connection. This will surely kill Plex Cloud.
And to complement all this here is my opinion and is all but an opinion:
Hi to all and whoever else is reading…
I personally think that NO ONE is going to guarantee ever the legal/copyright part of the issue EVER.
It could go encrypted/decrypted or whatever you people want to call it.
If your government/authorities/ISP ask to cancel your account then Amazon will cancel it without notice or dispute without
the owner of the account having the right to say anything.
This means that the library goes to the trash…
And I am not saying that people don´t use this for personal file or personal library but we all know that most of us human beings also use it for other means. But I didn´t say this ok?
Believe this happened not long ago with DYNDNS accounts all over the world being cancelled in a blink of an eye without any notice and without the right to say anything at all.
Thanks and I will be back and hope the idea that is great continues.
@okko said:
It would be great if Plex Pass users had a joint Plex Cloud / Amazon Storage account.
If we’re strictly talking about movies, I’m positive that multiple Plex Pass account holders have many of the same movies and therefore redundant files uploading to Amazon (forget for a moment the different file types like 1080P, 720P and so forth)
If we all shared 1 account, every Plex Pass member could be assigned a letter of the alphabet and are responsible for uploading media that starts with that particular letter. That way everyone contributes and is able to stream any movie that they want without redundant files lingering on Amazon.
I know, I know, kind of a Utopian society where it all comes together. But hey you gotta start somewhere.
I’m interested in the playback rate via various download speeds as well as what Amazon thinks of multiple TB’s of data being stored and the fact that 98% of them are movies/TV Shows that it’s not clear on they were “obtained”.
Anyone who is currently part of the Plex Cloud beta, able to say how seeking performs with it? e.g. fast forwarding half way through a movie, is it smooth like normal or is there a delay while it downloads the movie until that point to resume playback.
@l3uddz said:
Anyone who is currently part of the Plex Cloud beta, able to say how seeking performs with it? e.g. fast forwarding half way through a movie, is it smooth like normal or is there a delay while it downloads the movie until that point to resume playback.
As far as I can tell no-one is actually part of the beta yet as emails have not been sent out yet.
@l3uddz said:
Anyone who is currently part of the Plex Cloud beta, able to say how seeking performs with it? e.g. fast forwarding half way through a movie, is it smooth like normal or is there a delay while it downloads the movie until that point to resume playback.
As far as I can tell no-one is actually part of the beta yet as emails have not been sent out yet.
There is one user commenting in this thread who is indeed part of the beta, before it was publicly announced yesterday.
@l3uddz said:
Anyone who is currently part of the Plex Cloud beta, able to say how seeking performs with it? e.g. fast forwarding half way through a movie, is it smooth like normal or is there a delay while it downloads the movie until that point to resume playback.
As far as I can tell no-one is actually part of the beta yet as emails have not been sent out yet.
There is one user commenting in this thread who is indeed part of the beta, before it was publicly announced yesterday.
Oh my goodness, I must have missed that. Come on plex, I want my invite!!
@l3uddz said:
Anyone who is currently part of the Plex Cloud beta, able to say how seeking performs with it? e.g. fast forwarding half way through a movie, is it smooth like normal or is there a delay while it downloads the movie until that point to resume playback.
As far as I can tell no-one is actually part of the beta yet as emails have not been sent out yet.
There is one user commenting in this thread who is indeed part of the beta, before it was publicly announced yesterday.
Oh my goodness, I must have missed that. Come on plex, I want my invite!!
@d0cx said:
Wait so, if I have a Plex Pass already, will this service be free + ACD costs, or it’s ANOTHER Plex Pass + ACD costs? I’m lost here.
your existing PlexPass subscription is all you need, other than an ACD subscription
So you keep saying. @ASFx is saying so as well. Do any of you have any kind of information, such as a reference to an official statement by Plex, to back your respective opinion up?
The fact that this feature is something WAY out the normal direction by which existing Plex users utilize Plex, I think this feature is maybe something to draw in new users for new revenue.
By the way, renaming the file (illegal downloaded movie) will not help, usually the files are identified on the file hash value
Would this not require Amazon to constantly acquire all newly released pirated media so they knew what file hash values to scan for on user cloud drives?
