I’m not seeing what you’re seeing.
Here’s the post I made.
I don’t have forced transcodes or any of the symptoms described.
I must caveat that by adding I do not stream externally. (I have 2.5 Mbps upload speed). Almost everything here is DirectPlay . Occasionally, one of the devices will require an audio transcode.
Thanks so much for looking into this @ChuckPa!
Here are the things you asked for:
<Media id="81473" duration="847424" bitrate="4348" width="1248" height="520" aspectRatio="2.35" audioChannels="6" audioCodec="eac3" videoCodec="h264" videoResolution="576" container="mkv" videoFrameRate="24p" videoProfile="high">
<Part accessible="1" exists="1" id="85683" key="/library/parts/85683/1570372150/file.mkv" duration="847424" file="/Media/Television/Star Trek- Discovery/Specials/Star Trek- Discovery - S00E06 - Short Treks- Q&A.mkv" size="460596938" container="mkv" videoProfile="high">
<Stream id="195722" streamType="1" default="1" codec="h264" index="0" bitrate="4348" bitDepth="8" chromaLocation="left" chromaSubsampling="4:2:0" colorPrimaries="bt709" colorRange="tv" colorSpace="bt709" colorTrc="bt709" frameRate="24.000" hasScalingMatrix="0" height="520" level="31" profile="high" refFrames="4" scanType="progressive" width="1248" displayTitle="480p (H.264)"/>
<Stream id="195723" streamType="2" selected="1" default="1" codec="eac3" index="1" channels="6" language="English" languageCode="eng" audioChannelLayout="5.1(side)" samplingRate="48000" displayTitle="English (EAC3 5.1)"/>
<Stream id="195724" streamType="3" codec="srt" index="2" language="English" languageCode="eng" displayTitle="English (SRT)"/>
<Stream id="195725" streamType="3" codec="srt" index="3" language="English" languageCode="eng" title="SDH" displayTitle="English (SRT)"/>
</Part>
</Media>
Input #0, matroska,webm, from 'Star Trek- Discovery - S00E06 - Short Treks- Q&A.mkv':
Metadata:
encoder : libebml v1.3.9 + libmatroska v1.5.2
creation_time : 2019-10-06T14:12:52.000000Z
Duration: 00:14:07.42, start: 0.000000, bitrate: 4348 kb/s
General
Unique ID : 220565895132959441248922465607652205999 (0xA5EF723B20A4419164A4CBD9571FE5AF)
Complete name : Star Trek- Discovery - S00E06 - Short Treks- Q&A.mkv
Format : Matroska
Format version : Version 4
File size : 439 MiB
Duration : 14 min 7 s
Overall bit rate : 4 348 kb/s
Encoded date : UTC 2019-10-06 14:12:52
Writing application : mkvmerge v37.0.0 ('Leave It') 64-bit
Writing library : libebml v1.3.9 + libmatroska v1.5.2
Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L3.1
Format settings : CABAC / 4 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 4 frames
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 14 min 7 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 3 706 kb/s
Nominal bit rate : 6 000 kb/s
Width : 1 248 pixels
Height : 520 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 2.40:1
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 24.000 FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.238
Stream size : 374 MiB (85%)
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709
Audio
ID : 2
Format : E-AC-3
Format/Info : Enhanced AC-3
Commercial name : Dolby Digital Plus
Codec ID : A_EAC3
Duration : 14 min 7 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 640 kb/s
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel layout : L R C LFE Ls Rs
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 64.7 MiB (15%)
Language : English
Service kind : Complete Main
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Text #1
ID : 3
Format : UTF-8
Codec ID : S_TEXT/UTF8
Codec ID/Info : UTF-8 Plain Text
Duration : 11 min 43 s
Bit rate : 79 b/s
Count of elements : 205
Stream size : 6.81 KiB (0%)
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No
Text #2
ID : 4
Format : UTF-8
Codec ID : S_TEXT/UTF8
Codec ID/Info : UTF-8 Plain Text
Duration : 12 min 28 s
Bit rate : 77 b/s
Count of elements : 218
Stream size : 7.08 KiB (0%)
Title : SDH
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No
The root cause of the issue is that PMS is unable to detect the audio bitrate of the file, it then makes the streaming brain spaz out on the Fire TV, resulting in the VIDEO being transcoded when it does not need to be (likely only over remote connections)
If I remux the file with older versions of MKVToolNIX (v19 and under I think) then Plex can detect the audio bitrate and the file can be played properly without a video transcode. This may mostly apply to MKV files with EAC3 audio but I’m pretty sure I also have a few MKV’s with AAC audio that are also affected
Edit: Here is a one minute sample of a an affected file in case you want to play around with it
A few basic questions.
Is this home streaming or remote streaming?
If at home, why is “automatically adjust” even enabled? There is no need?
It’s remote streaming. I moved my server to a datacenter a while back and never looked back. But the wild thing is I have my client setup so that “automatically adjust” is disabled and to playback remote videos at Original Quality. In addition I do not have an overall upload speed or remote stream bitrate specified in “Remote Access” on my server
Edit: From what I can gather the sequence of events seems to be:
PMS does not register an audio bitrate for most MKV’s with EAC3 audio
My Fire TV devices can not direct play EAC3 audio and my TV’s are incapable of HDMI passthrough
Normally that would be fine and result in an audio-only transcode BUT since there is no audio bitrate info, Plex determines the needed bandwidth to be some astronomical amount (2+ GBPS)
Since I don’t have an overall remote bandwidth limit specified on my Plex server or the Fire TV Plex client that should also be fine BUT it turns out that even at “Original” remote quality there is a hardcoded 200mbps limit on Fire TV devices
The 200mbps hardcoded client limit would be fine under almost any circumstance BUT since Plex is incorrectly estimating that the file would need 10x that amount of bandwidth, both the video and the audio of the file are transcoded
For the sake of science I remuxed one of the EAC3/MKV’s with a much older version of MKVToolNix (v19). PMS was able to detect the audio bitrate correctly and then the file played back on my Fire TV with the expected behavior- the audio was transcoded but the video was direct-steamed
Please show me where it’s estimating 10x that?
Show me how you have come to this conclusion.
If you’re going by the “Fudge Factor” in the logs… stop there. It’s a fixed estimator. it’s intermediate calculationns not the final.
Hey man I hope the tone of my previous message didn’t come across as accusatory or condescending in any way. I was merely offering my very limited and quite possibly very incorrect understanding of what may be going on. Maybe @anon18523487 can chime in to better summarize the issue as he initially pointed out if was likely due to the missing audio bitrate metadata
Anyway here’s a snippet of the PMS Server Log during playback:
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.574 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - We're going to try to auto-select an audio stream for account 584228.
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.574 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Selecting best audio stream for part ID 85683 (autoselect: 1 language: en)
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.574 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Audio Stream: 195723, Subtitle Stream: -1
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.575 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Streaming Resource: Attempting to create AdHoc transcode session 186b4c124410f9dd-com-plexapp-android
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.575 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: Selected protocol hls; container: mpegts
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.575 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: analyzing media item 81473
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.575 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: Direct Play is disabled
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.575 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: media must be transcoded in order to use the hls protocol
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.575 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: no direct play video profile exists for http/mkv/h264
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.575 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: no direct play video profile exists for http/mkv/h264/eac3
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.576 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: Star Trek: Discovery - E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: selected media 0 / 81473
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.576 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Streaming Resource: Required bandwidth unknown (media requires deep analysis) Changing decision parameters provided by client to fit bandwidth limit of 200000kbps
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.576 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Streaming Resource: Determining preferred transcode encoders through transcode only decision.
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.576 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Scaled up video bitrate to 6522Kbps based on 1.500000x fudge factor.
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.577 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Scaled up video bitrate to 6522Kbps based on 1.500000x fudge factor.
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.577 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Streaming Resource: Reducing playback quality for 190476kbps stream bitrate: video resolution to 1248x520, audio channels to 6, quality to 99, disable video DS as 2147483647kbps is > the 6489kbps available, disable audio DS as 2147483647kbps is > the 768kbps available
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.577 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Scaled up video bitrate to 6522Kbps based on 1.500000x fudge factor.
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: Selected protocol hls; container: mpegts
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: analyzing media item 81473
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: Direct Play is disabled
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: media must be transcoded in order to use the hls protocol
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: no direct play video profile exists for http/mkv/h264
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: no direct play video profile exists for http/mkv/h264/eac3
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: Direct Streaming is disabled, so video stream will be transcoded
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: no remuxable profile found, so video stream will be transcoded
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: Cannot direct stream video stream due to profile or setting limitations
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Scaled up video bitrate to 6522Kbps based on 1.500000x fudge factor.
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: Audio Direct Streaming is disabled, so video's audio stream will be transcoded
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: Cannot direct stream audio stream due to profile or setting limitations
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.578 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - MDE: Star Trek: Discovery - E6 - Short Treks: Q&A: selected media 0 / 81473
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.579 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Streaming Resource: Adding session 0x7f827c76bcf0:186b4c124410f9dd-com-plexapp-android which is using 7620kbps of WAN bandwidth. Used is now 7620kbps
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.579 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Streaming Resource: Adding session 0x7f827c76bcf0:186b4c124410f9dd-com-plexapp-android which is using transcoder slot. Used slots is now 1
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.579 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Streaming Resource: Added session 0x7f827c76bcf0:186b4c124410f9dd-com-plexapp-android
Mar 17, 2020 23:22:22.579 [0x7f82777fe700] DEBUG - Streaming Resource: Reached Decision id=38475 codes=(General=1001,Direct play not available; Conversion OK. Direct Play=3000,App cannot direct play this item. Direct play is disabled. Transcode=1001,Direct play not available; Conversion OK.) media=(id=81473 part=(id=85683 decision=transcode container=mpegts protocol=hls streams=(Video=(id=195722 decision=transcode bitrate=6489 encoder=libx264 width=1248 height=520) Audio=(id=195723 decision=transcode bitrate=768 encoder=aac channels=6 rate=48000))))
If it was unclear your help is very much appreciated. Thank you again for looking into this for me. Cheers
Edit: Streaming Resource: Reducing playback quality for 190476kbps stream bitrate: video resolution to 1248x520, audio channels to 6, quality to 99, disable video DS as 2147483647kbps is > the 6489kbps available, disable audio DS as 2147483647kbps is > the 768kbps available
This line specifically made me think it was doing some kind of whacky estimation but I freely admit I really have no clue what’s going on there
please notice what it says there?
It sees the video bitrate (with the 1.5x multiply) at 6522 Kbps
However, it doesn’t have the deep analysis of the video (runs during maintenance) it needs to work for automatic adjust.
Therefore, it’s going to go by what the client says it can handle. This is what’s forcing the transcode.
Yeah I went through that with @anon18523487 earlier in the thread. I have deep analysis completely disabled on my server since all my storage is mounted remotely
Just to clarify I also do not have any auto-adjust/adaptive setting enabled on the client. And any EAC3/MKV’s that has audio bit-rate metadata showing up in Plex (those created with older versions of MKVToolNIX) are direct streamed properly (only the audio transcodes)
If I take the same problematic EAC3/MKV and remux it with MKVToolNIX v19, the audio bitrate is indeed able to be detected by Plex and the video is direct-streamed properly to the Fire TV (only the audio transcodes). This is with deep analysis still completely turned off on the server
Spin this test:
I ran the following command:
ffmpeg -i Disco.mkv -c:v copy -c:a aac -b:a 256k Disco-AAC.mkv
Plex still does not detect the audio-bitrate of the resulting file but the Fire TV can play it fine since it can decode AAC natively
Here is the Plex XML of the resulting file (no audio bitrate):
<Media id="133479" duration="60124" bitrate="4571" width="1248" height="520" aspectRatio="2.35" audioChannels="6" audioCodec="aac" videoCodec="h264" videoResolution="576" container="mkv" videoFrameRate="24p" audioProfile="lc" videoProfile="high">
<Part accessible="1" exists="1" id="139369" key="/library/parts/139369/1584562560/file.mkv" duration="60124" file="/samples/startrek/Disco-AAC.mkv" size="34354268" audioProfile="lc" container="mkv" videoProfile="high">
<Stream id="338517" streamType="1" default="1" codec="h264" index="0" bitrate="4571" bitDepth="8" chromaLocation="left" chromaSubsampling="4:2:0" codedHeight="528" codedWidth="1248" colorPrimaries="bt709" colorRange="tv" colorSpace="bt709" colorTrc="bt709" frameRate="24.000" hasScalingMatrix="0" height="520" level="31" profile="high" refFrames="4" scanType="progressive" width="1248" displayTitle="480p (H.264)"/>
<Stream id="338518" streamType="2" selected="1" default="1" codec="aac" index="1" channels="6" language="English" languageCode="eng" profile="lc" samplingRate="48000" displayTitle="English (AAC 5.1)"/>
<Stream id="338519" streamType="3" codec="ass" index="2" language="English" languageCode="eng" displayTitle="English (ASS)"/>
</Part>
</Media>
Here is the MediInfo (contains audio bitrate):
General
Unique ID : 237520891376917022167527581807738535094 (0xB2B0DC1616835F1188FA1C226932BCB6)
Complete name : Disco-AAC.mkv
Format : Matroska
Format version : Version 4
File size : 32.8 MiB
Duration : 1 min 0 s
Overall bit rate : 4 571 kb/s
Writing application : Lavf58.20.100
Writing library : Lavf58.20.100
ErrorDetectionType : Per level 1
Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L3.1
Format settings : CABAC / 4 Ref Frames
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 4 frames
Codec ID : V_MPEG4/ISO/AVC
Duration : 1 min 0 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 4 324 kb/s
Nominal bit rate : 6 000 kb/s
Width : 1 248 pixels
Height : 520 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 2.40:1
Frame rate mode : Variable
Frame rate : 24.000 FPS
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.278
Stream size : 30.9 MiB (94%)
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Color range : Limited
Color primaries : BT.709
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.709
Audio
ID : 2
Format : AAC LC
Format/Info : Advanced Audio Codec Low Complexity
Codec ID : A_AAC-2
Duration : 1 min 0 s
Bit rate : 640 kb/s
Channel(s) : 6 channels
Channel layout : L R C Cb Rls Rb
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 46.875 FPS (1024 SPF)
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 4.58 MiB (14%)
Writing library : Lavc58.35.100 aac
Language : English
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Text
ID : 3
Format : ASS
Codec ID : S_TEXT/ASS
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Sub Station Alpha
Duration : 1 min 0 s
Bit rate : 55 b/s
Count of elements : 4
Compression mode : Lossless
Stream size : 91.0 Bytes (0%)
Writing library : Lavc58.35.100 ssa
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No
On thing to note is that I attempted to specify the audio bitrate in ffmpeg at 256kbps but MediaInfo is reporting that the audio bitrate of the resulting file is 640kbps. Either I botched the command (I’m very much a ffmpeg novice) or MediaInfo is also also unable to detect the audio bitrate and simply filling in the field with a dummy value of 640kbps
Edit: ffmpeg is also reporting an audio-bitrate of 640kbps on the resulting file
Input #0, matroska,webm, from 'Disco-AAC.mkv':
Metadata:
ENCODER : Lavf58.20.100
Duration: 00:01:00.12, start: 0.000000, bitrate: 4571 kb/s
Stream #0:0: Video: h264 (High), yuv420p(tv, bt709, progressive), 1248x520 [SAR 1:1 DAR 12:5], 24 fps, 24 tbr, 1k tbn, 48 tbc (default)
Metadata:
BPS-eng : 4324231
DURATION-eng : 00:01:00.000000000
NUMBER_OF_FRAMES-eng: 1440
NUMBER_OF_BYTES-eng: 32431736
_STATISTICS_WRITING_APP-eng: mkvmerge v29.0.0 ('Like It Or Not') 64-bit
_STATISTICS_WRITING_DATE_UTC-eng: 2019-10-19 05:33:43
_STATISTICS_TAGS-eng: BPS DURATION NUMBER_OF_FRAMES NUMBER_OF_BYTES
DURATION : 00:01:00.020000000
Stream #0:1(eng): Audio: aac (LC), 48000 Hz, 5.1, fltp (default)
Metadata:
BPS-eng : 640000
DURATION-eng : 00:01:00.000000000
NUMBER_OF_FRAMES-eng: 1875
NUMBER_OF_BYTES-eng: 4800000
_STATISTICS_WRITING_APP-eng: mkvmerge v29.0.0 ('Like It Or Not') 64-bit
_STATISTICS_WRITING_DATE_UTC-eng: 2019-10-19 05:33:43
_STATISTICS_TAGS-eng: BPS DURATION NUMBER_OF_FRAMES NUMBER_OF_BYTES
ENCODER : Lavc58.35.100 aac
DURATION : 00:01:00.021000000
Stream #0:2(eng): Subtitle: ass
Metadata:
BPS-eng : 55
DURATION-eng : 00:00:13.100000000
NUMBER_OF_FRAMES-eng: 4
NUMBER_OF_BYTES-eng: 91
_STATISTICS_WRITING_APP-eng: mkvmerge v29.0.0 ('Like It Or Not') 64-bit
_STATISTICS_WRITING_DATE_UTC-eng: 2019-10-19 05:33:43
_STATISTICS_TAGS-eng: BPS DURATION NUMBER_OF_FRAMES NUMBER_OF_BYTES
ENCODER : Lavc58.35.100 ssa
DURATION : 00:01:00.124000000
It didn’t update . Notice PMS still thinks it has subtitles?
Your ffmpeg command did not include -c:s copy
One point is clear. AAC is what’s supported natively.
Hmm the resulting file does have a subtitle track. It is now ASS instead of SRT and contains the same text as the input file. Maybe the default behavior off ffmpeg is to copy the subtitle track? (I originally cut off the ffmpeg info which shows the output file’s subtitle metadata and have now updated it)
I definitely get that AAC is supported natively by my device but shouldn’t Plex be able to transcode the audio from EAC3 to AAC on-the-fly while leaving the video untouched? It seems to do so properly as long as PMS can detect and audio bitrate from the source file. It’s just when there is no audio bitrate metadata detected that it for some reason transcodes the video in addition to the audio
Correct. That’s why I say “It didn’t analyze”
You must manually press “Analyze” so Plex scans the file again In-Place after replacing it.
Hmm To be honest Chuck I’m a little confused. Why do you believe the file has not been analyzed? To be clear the input file was H264/EAC3/SRT and the output is H264/AAC/ASS. When playing the output file in VLC it does indeed have ASS subs. As far as I can tell Plex has indeed analyzed it correctly except for the lack of audio bitrate
my apologies. I misread.
(not doing the best here. pretty sick).
May we take this up further tomorrow / day after?
god damnit, get better, get rested.
No problem at all. I’ve been in bed all day with a cold myself. Come back to it whenever you’re feeling better
When you do maybe you can run:
ffmpeg -i movie.avi -c:v libx264 -c:a eac3 movie-h264-eac3.mkv
Or something similar on an item in your library and confirm for me that Plex does not detect the audio bitrate of the resulting file. Just to make sure I’m not doing something terribly wrong here. Take care and stay safe
Hope you’re feeling better Chuck. If you have time let me know if you have any further ideas for resolving this issue
Can you get me a 20MB sample?
ffmpeg -i movie.avi -c:v libx264 -c:a eac3 movie-h264-eac3.mkv
I noticed that running the above command on any pretty much any video file in my library will produce a file where the audio bitrate is not detected by my Plex server. I’d be very interested to know if that’s reproducible on your end
Here is a 35mb sample I had handy in my Dropbox. If it’s too large I can make a smaller one when I get home
