@janngobble said:
You need to understand @elan, we don’t believe Plex. We can’t afford to.
Just to be pedantic, trust is a big part of this. If we’re not trustworthy, we could give you an opt-out toggle which did nothing except make you feel better. We are not that company. We’re the same group of media loving fanatics (and users!) we were 10 years ago. The reason why I’m in here commenting over and over again is that I care about the way you feel, and we’re reading and listening to what you’re saying.
Hello, this is my third or fourth post on this issue and I’ve never had the need to post on this forum. I’ve been a Plex pass user for many years now and a happy customer that enjoyed all the news.
I learned a lot about the upcoming GDPR rules in the past few months since I have this role at my company, and I am pretty sure that this policy change does not comply with GDPR.
According to GDPR, a customer has the right to see and have a complete insight in what data is stored on the servers /backup/third party.
My question to @elan is: Will Plex as a company comply with GDPR rules? If not, are you aware of the consequences?
@djumv said:
So who are you selling the data to, plex?
FBI, RIAA, MPAA, DOJ?
We’re not selling or giving the data away to anyone.
While that may be the case, a subpoena for it would say otherwise. If data doesn’t exist, then that is the only time that statement can be 100% accurate.
@janngobble said:
You need to understand @elan, we don’t believe Plex. We can’t afford to.
Just to be pedantic, trust is a big part of this. If we’re not trustworthy, we could give you an opt-out toggle which did nothing except make you feel better. We are not that company. We’re the same group of media loving fanatics (and users!) we were 10 years ago. The reason why I’m in here commenting over and over again is that I care about the way you feel, and we’re reading and listening to what you’re saying.
Are you truly listening? Because from what’s been said so far, you seem to be sitting atop your throne yelling “WRONG” and “FAKE NEWS” every time one of us brings up a concern.
As well, instead of giving us a button that does nothing, you’re simply taking the button away. That’s nearly as bad as lying to us about it.
But in that case you should also know that you are not allowed to gather data of a user who hasn’t given consent to it. As of 25.5.2018 this would would be a clear violation against European law.
@J@cco said:
First time post on this forum as a fresh plex pass user I notice, Elan, that you are only trying to justify the changes made to the policy instead of listening to your, or at least some significant portion of your customers.
Having said that, I would like to know how to initiate that refund please:
“I don’t think we can have a productive conversation about this, but I’m happy to refund you your lifetime membership if you’d like. I’m truly sorry that these changes have upset you as much as they have.”
He hasn’t said the company will refund everybody who asks for it… He said it to one specific user He’s even been asked if that is open to everybody, and there has been no response.
I’d understand if there were no option to opt out of sending usage statistics for free accounts, but those of us who paid for a lifetime pass should be given the option to retain our privacy and opt out. Don’t remove it. Keep that in. I don’t get why it has to be mandatory. Really upset by these policy changes.
Honestly … don’t you think we reached now a point where it would make sense to involve a communications specialist? Gather an emergency task force, assess the situation and for at least once respond in a professional manner?
I mean, ignoring thousands of user complaints and feature requests over months (if not years) is one thing. But this now is pushing your indifference of your clients needs and wishes not only to a absolute new level, but also very close to illegal behaviour.
@djumv said:
So who are you selling the data to, plex?
FBI, RIAA, MPAA, DOJ?
We’re not selling or giving the data away to anyone.
No, you’ll just make it available to subpoenas or leaks (which has happened already al la Plex)
A twist of words, “selling or GIVING THE DATA AWAY”. Sure, you won’t sell it or simply give it away for free. But, you’ll hand it over when demanded. Because, well, now you’ll have that data TO hand over. Regardless of just -what- that data would represent. You’ve yet to touch base on my posts regarding the data being OURS because it is generated from OUR files on OUR hardware, sent by OUR hardware via OUR ISP (as in the one we pay for our service). Now before someone jumps in on “well your ISP blah blah blah”, we use Plex knowing it is encrypted. Sure packet headers could tell them “hey its media going to Plex”, but then that will be dealt with at the ISP. This isn’t the forums of any one of the plethora of worldwide ISP’s. This is the PLEX forum, so, let’s keep apples with apples.
Honest question: minus the ability to identify the media being played by Plex users…can someone explain to me exactly why this is so upsetting to people? What nefarious purposes could this data be used for?
@DFury said:
Honest question: minus the ability to identify the media being played by Plex users…can someone explain to me exactly why this is so upsetting to people? What nefarious purposes could this data be used for?
It doesn’t matter. The majority of people reject data gathering. They don’t want their software to spy on them or at least have the option to opt-out.
It’s simply unwanted behavior. And because a lot of companies still think it’s okay laws are now passed with severe penalties to make even the dumbest CEO aware of the fact that people want him to respect their privacy.
@hexluther said:
A twist of words, “selling or GIVING THE DATA AWAY”. Sure, you won’t sell it or simply give it away for free. But, you’ll hand it over when demanded.
I’m assuming you’re referring to data about media stored in or played from people’s private libraries, which I’ve already told you we have no interest in having. As I pointed out elsewhere, people raised the concern around “secondary data” (e.g. durations), and we’re going to ensure the data is “fuzzed” to the point where it’s not identifiable.
Is there other specific data you’re worried about?
@DFury said:
Honest question: minus the ability to identify the media being played by Plex users…can someone explain to me exactly why this is so upsetting to people? What nefarious purposes could this data be used for?
Understandable question. I suppose. But honestly, if you don’t understand, I don’t feel any amount of words will assist you in understanding. That isn’t meant to be offensive, rather, just, common sense. If you don’t “get it” now, you won’t. With one exception. That you value your fellow man’s right to privacy. If you do, then you should get it.
@DFury said:
Honest question: minus the ability to identify the media being played by Plex users
That’s the only reason you need. Is it not? Law enforcement warrants, media company purchases of the information…List goes on. Unless your library is entirely legal, and if you ripped your own content it isn’t, then you should be afraid.
@janngobble said:
You need to understand @elan, we don’t believe Plex. We can’t afford to.
Just to be pedantic, trust is a big part of this. If we’re not trustworthy, we could give you an opt-out toggle which did nothing except make you feel better. We are not that company. We’re the same group of media loving fanatics (and users!) we were 10 years ago. The reason why I’m in here commenting over and over again is that I care about the way you feel, and we’re reading and listening to what you’re saying.
Hello, this is my third or fourth post on this issue and I’ve never had the need to post on this forum. I’ve been a Plex pass user for many years now and a happy customer that enjoyed all the news.
I learned a lot about the upcoming GDPR rules in the past few months since I have this role at my company, and I am pretty sure that this policy change does not comply with GDPR.
According to GDPR, a customer has the right to see and have a complete insight in what data is stored on the servers /backup/third party.
My question to @elan is: Will Plex as a company comply with GDPR rules? If not, are you aware of the consequences?
/Mike
I have been reading about this today (I am in the US but it interested me) and are you sure it has to do with data like this? I thought the complete insight into stored data was for “sensitive personal data”. Just wondering, obviously as someone who is a DPO (at least I think that is what you would be called) you know a lot better that someone who is just reading/researching about it today (that would be me).
@hexluther said:
A twist of words, “selling or GIVING THE DATA AWAY”. Sure, you won’t sell it or simply give it away for free. But, you’ll hand it over when demanded.
I’m assuming you’re referring to data about media stored in or played from people’s private libraries, which I’ve already told you we have no interest in having. As I pointed out elsewhere, people raised the concern around “secondary data” (e.g. durations), and we’re going to ensure the data is “fuzzed” to the point where it’s not identifiable.
Is there other specific data you’re worried about?
No, I’m referring to the metadata. To know duration, you have to read OUR files. To know codec used, you have to examine OUR files. So on and so forth. Come on now. I’m not in with the “duration” crowd. I’m in with the “none of it is any of your damned business” crowd. It’s produced using our files, on our hardware, via our ISP (that we pay and have contract with which, is also nunya as in nunya business), etc, etc.
However, since I (at least at this moment) have a line with you again. Just out of curiosity sakes, would you mind telling us precisely what such data is used for? x.264 is x.264, HVEC is HVEC, MP3 is MP3. How does creating metadata from what is being streamed (of ANY type) helpful in improving services when standards already exist. I’m going to regret asking this, as I’m afraid it will be the only thing quoted and addressed, if anything. But, I’ll refrain, I’ll try to remain optimistic.
@hexluther said:
A twist of words, “selling or GIVING THE DATA AWAY”. Sure, you won’t sell it or simply give it away for free. But, you’ll hand it over when demanded.
I’m assuming you’re referring to data about media stored in or played from people’s private libraries, which I’ve already told you we have no interest in having. As I pointed out elsewhere, people raised the concern around “secondary data” (e.g. durations), and we’re going to ensure the data is “fuzzed” to the point where it’s not identifiable.
Is there other specific data you’re worried about?
To all who had possibly hoped for a roll back of this new policy - Elan’s statements continue to note what they will be doing with the data - they are not talking about rolling any of this back on their calls today. They are talking about how best to calm this storm and move forward with the decisions as have already been made. The above pretty clearly shows this.
Following the discussion all day now. To bad Plex doesn’t listen to its customers…
Until now I never had the need to look to alternatives. If Plex will not respect my privacy by giving me a choice to share data or not, I also want to refund my Lifetime Plex pass…
@hexluther said:
A twist of words, “selling or GIVING THE DATA AWAY”. Sure, you won’t sell it or simply give it away for free. But, you’ll hand it over when demanded.
and we’re going to ensure the data is “fuzzed” to the point where it’s not identifiable.
Be specific. Release an actual example of someone that’s opted ins data. All of it. Perhaps yours even to show us how little we have to fear.
He’s even been asked if that is open to everybody, and there has been no response.